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DWAs as actual seige units
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xyzc2
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Joined: 08 Jul 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 7:49 pm    Post subject: DWAs as actual seige units Reply with quote

Base battles suck. People sit in their nodes and unless you outnumber them 3 to 1, you're gonna have a bad time.

So here's the suggestion:
- Allow all weapons added to have up to 12 range
- Give SSM main gun acti: Deploy to get + 5 range on main gun (but can't fire for... 2 turns?). Maybe also give a shield boost
- Remove the X var, and make the main gun 10 range 50 dmg baseline (so it's actually economical to drop them)


Open to other suggestions. I think with this fix, you'd be able to actually force base-squatters to come out and fight.
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Peace
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Joined: 11 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suggested something similar, but to just remove the range limit on DWA altogether.


That would give them a max range of 15. They cant gain +3 range from Gyrojet due to having Build Effect already.

So with balanced and SGA on them, they could get to 15. I think that would balance them out a lot, force people out of their bases to pick them off also.

No health boost is needed. Artillery irl is generally extremely exposed without being defended and easily destroyed.

I do think the X var could be knocked off and the damage buffed though. They are an extremely slow and paper unit, 20 base damage sucks lol.
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khaibar
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They do double damage to buildings and take half damage from them not to mention that they ignore phase stuff.

Denied
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Peace
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But if there are ANY defenders, they die instantly. And if there are no defenders, any unit is more effective than a DWA
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xyzc2
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2015 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, they already have buffs already, and they're close to useless. At least this can be seen as a cursory solution to base-sitting and having to wait for everyone to go afk before assaulting.

Sure they ignore phase stuff. Try putting one in close enough range to actually hit even a moderately defended base and tell me how it goes.
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Vinzkillx
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2015 6:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

khaibar wrote:
They do double damage to buildings and take half damage from them not to mention that they ignore phase stuff.

Denied


Agreed with Khai DWA does about 40 damage that's like the most perfect pure damage to buildings.And for shields, Guys we have unit called Aegis Shield Meka they can tank quiet hard and really use full in base assault, and not to mention 10 range DWA is the perfect weapon for base assault. The question is... What kind of strategy you develop?
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tomohawk
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

khaibar wrote:
They do double damage to buildings and take half damage from them not to mention that they ignore phase stuff.

Denied


You forgot about the 120 unit army that will dust them in 1 turn and is sitting in the base.....
Take if from the people who fight bases....
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Dogg1000
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps the problem lies in the overpowered support buildings rather than the kind-of-okay offensive units.
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Peace
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Joined: 11 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dont think support is overpowered really. If there isnt any defenders then its super easy to roll a base, Phase and support only buys a couple turns for someone to hopefully deploy.

DWA have less range than Goons, Longrifles, SSM, sentries, Obliteration cannon, etc. But are "SIEGE" units. Their range should definitely be more than 10 lol. Its a horribly designed unit.


How about an acti like Long-Rifle to increase range by 5 or something.

"Deploy Siege - Unit gains +6 Main Gun Max Range. Unit cannot move. Unit deals no damage to Units."
"Undeploy Siege - Unit loses +6 Main Gun Max Range Bonus. Unit can move after 3 turns. Unit Cannot Fire while undeploying main gun"
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haloguy48
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know anyone else personally who's actually field-tested a DWA army besides myself, for Bandits AND PvP, and I at one point had a talk with Frizz about them. The buffs they were given, without raising their CE, and a few other things were seen as the best result. At the time we had very little, if any unit, over 10 range, and a unit having more than that was feared to to abuse such an ability. Basically being able to kill most of a base without worrying about turrets if players aren't online.

AS FOR DWAs AS THEY SIT.

Albeit sucky as hell, they are relatively decent Vs. Bandit Nodes. Get a scout to drag the bandits out, kill them, and then jump a whole 2 into the base (or 4, Hydra OP). Sit back, fire, kill a line of turrets, move forward one, rinse, repeat. With 50 or so, losses are minimal, so long as you have BDII, MDII, Hightower, Hydra setup(bring that R var). Though, if I recall before DII mods, I had HT, Hydra, Holofield, Thunder Clap.

Needs an MSCU, for sure. BAI jumping in first, 10 or so, nothing but armor, works well too.

Honestly it needs a Mark 2, a real PvP Bringer, a Base Sieger. Probably would end up Elite though at the rate of what it should be though. But that's just my 2 cents.

HG48
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Peace
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

50 DWA o.O


We use 16-20 gats to take out entire bandit or shak bases.


DWA suck =P
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haloguy48
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Peace wrote:
50 DWA o.O


We use 16-20 gats to take out entire bandit or shak bases.


DWA suck =P


Meant to say 40, I kept my army counter as close to 50 as possible when I was trying to optimize them. It was also one of the arguments I made about DWAs. Usually 8-10 BA, 1 MSCU, 2 Hermits, and my Super Sai (before it became the DERII it is today) Laughing ... Actually at that time I think I upgraded to a lightfoot or Juggernaut. Anywho.

16-20 gat @ how much CE compared to how much per gat?

I'm at 980CE per DWA. A 3s gat (ht, supp grade, hydra) is 2476.

Sooo @ 16 i'm deploying basically 40k(39,616) ce in gats alone, whereas DWA wise I can drop the same amount in 40 units. CE(39,200).

Where one gat is doing 48 dmg(DRS), and a total of 768 for them all, a DWA does doing 33 dmg(DMR)for a total of 1320 for all 40. So long you believed in RNGesus, and they didn't single out your DWAs, you did quite a decent clear.

TL;DR:

DWA to Gat Ratio, DWAs do more dmg in sacrifice for health per CE Vs buildings, and are MUCH cheaper. Almost a 3 to 1 ratio CE wise.


Edit:

Sha'Kahr EAT DWAs for 2nd brunch, don't try it.
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Peace
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if all your stuff is 1 hit and you lose the assault it cost a whole lot more
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haloguy48
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 3-6 times I recall I used them, with the first being the worst(think i lost 65%+ that time), I only lost about 2-10 with a (near) full recovery once I got used to it. I lost the entirety of them when I tried to Sha'kahr with them though, even with a BA buffer.

I found my old notes actually, and the mod setup I said was actually correct XD. 38 DWA, Cmmdr, 10 BA/BAII, Hermit/Scout. Guess I redropped for salvage. Then again I never could keep hermits alive long anyways.
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Peace
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Im referring to a defended base. They cant do anything if someone drops even 10 units. And they will ignore the BA and knock out your DWA first.

DWA need some sort of tactical advantage to
A: Not make them so paper
B: Give them advantage against being hit
C: Keep them out of the fight but still able to attack


Any of those 3. C makes the most sense due to the fact its a siege unit.
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